Curse

iostream · Jan 20, 2011, 10:11 PM // 22:11

Hi everyone!

I just recently got my war to LDoA and am running him through all the campaigns. So far am loving it with two great builds: earthshaker+crude swing+whirlwind+earthshaker ad naseum AND 100b+whirlwind+sun&moon+MoP. Always with a splinter+strength and honor hero too.

I really enjoy playing my war because of aggro control. It actually requires some thought and micro. I also have MoP disabled and hotkeyed on a hero.

My question is: are there any war veterans who can give some tips on how to aggro control better in general PvE? Big and small things that newbies might miss. There's nothing more fun than chain earthshakers or blowing things up in one hit with 100b, and to do that properly you need enemies to bunch up around you.

This applies to both H/H and pugs. It may be easier to aggro control with H/H then your general pug (not sure, have not yet joined pugs with my war) as in my experience people generally run around like headless chickens anyway. In such a situation what do you do to grab and retain control? Skills to use? Positioning tips? Etc

Ryno_Noobslayer · Jan 20, 2011, 10:45 PM // 22:45

1st) Congrats on LDoA

2nd) Glad to see someone who enjoys Earthshaker as much as me

3rd) Marty Silverblade wrote a nice comprehensive "Warrior in PVE" guide in the warrior forum. He doesn't go into to much detail on aggro control but he makes very good points.

These points include:

When you are in a PUG aggro control is not just your responsibility. Every other human player in the group needs to have enough common sense to know what that little circle around them is and what it will do if red dots get in it. It can be frustrating to play with PUGs but if you get a good one (or better yet play with guildies) it can also be very rewarding and fun.

When using H/H you are going to be the only one capable of managing aggro. Where you position your heroes and henchies will play a huge part. So if you don't like planting flags all over the place then extremely effective aggro control with a H/H team may not be quite in your reach. The key point here to remember is that while YOUR positioning is very important, your TEAM'S positioning is just as if not more important. A warrior can't manage aggro when there are two monks next to him, but the same is true if you are pulling enemies. Don't pull them to where your aggro bubble meets a backliners.

Your skills can play a huge role in aggro control. Namely "SAVE YOURSELVES!". While this PVE only skill (luxon or kurzick) adds a massive defensive buff to the rest of the party (as long as they are in earshot mind you) it has a second less thought of role. By giving the rest of the party +100 armor you are making yourself the lowest armored member of the party, therefore enemy monsters will find you a better target whent they check armor ratings.

Since you are using what I like to refer to as the Warrior BOOM BOOM skills (Whirlwind, MoP, Splinter, 100B, etc) it is important to make sure that either you space out the time between dealing damage, or make sure everything is dead before it can move. Massive AoE damage caused by those skills will often cause mobs to scatter and you will have to start over on the aggro control.

Link to Marty's Guide:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/w...t10326347.html

Bristlebane · Jan 20, 2011, 11:20 PM // 23:20

You most likely know this already, but it's great to pull around corners and block the path. Mobs won't be able to pass you going for weaker targets so they stay at you.

Grasping Earth might be a good skill if you like snaring mobs, even 3 points in Earth Magic will snare for 10 seconds. It's cheap, it's fast, and it snares in nearby range. It can also help cover hexes from your team, and you can easily knock down any snared foe moving away from you with Bull's Strike. This also works great with "None Shall Pass" when your team's AE cause scattering, knock them all down, and they will all limp back to you once they're up again.

iostream · Jan 21, 2011, 12:01 AM // 00:01

Great responses guys.

@ryno
Pugs:
It's true pugs can be pretty bad, I was just wondering whether it is possible to do things to make the best of a bad situation if everyone has no concept of aggro control (or even just one person doing it wrong screws it up well enough)
SY!:
I love SY. When playing on my imba it's godmode for the whole team. However, I have found that on my war while H/H I don't like to use it for a couple of reasons. First, if I ball the mob correctly there is no need for SY because they either are on their ass all the time or they die instantly from 100b/MoP. Second, if I failed in balling the mob SY takes a long time to charge, drains adren, and it just seems more efficient neutralising the enemy's DPS through frequent earthshakers rather than spending adren on SY

@bristlebane:
I like the None shall pass idea, it's great. Have got to go try it now

I have a slight problem with balling stuff in full H/H HM pve. Balling is all well and good, but there's a sweet spot between balling things, surviving, and then dishing it out. Currrently I find that sometimes, just on the point when I'm about to land the whirlwind/earthshaker, I die 1 second short and it all goes to hell.

When balling I rely on my armor and prot spirit and have no defensive skills (pure strength spec). Should I bring some so that I can survive longer? Or have more micro'ed prots on heros such as SoA? I would like something that is not overly cumbersome to use.

I guess as well I should be quick and efficient in balling foes as if I take too long about it, SoA would run out and I will die.

MisterB · Jan 21, 2011, 12:09 AM // 00:09

You may find the following thread useful, especially the videos.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/p...tml?t=10434178

Ryno_Noobslayer · Jan 21, 2011, 01:08 AM // 01:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by iostream

Great responses guys.

@ryno
Pugs:
It's true pugs can be pretty bad, I was just wondering whether it is possible to do things to make the best of a bad situation if everyone has no concept of aggro control (or even just one person doing it wrong screws it up well enough)
SY!:
I love SY. When playing on my imba it's godmode for the whole team. However, I have found that on my war while H/H I don't like to use it for a couple of reasons. First, if I ball the mob correctly there is no need for SY because they either are on their ass all the time or they die instantly from 100b/MoP. Second, if I failed in balling the mob SY takes a long time to charge, drains adren, and it just seems more efficient neutralising the enemy's DPS through frequent earthshakers rather than spending adren on SY

I have a slight problem with balling stuff in full H/H HM pve. Balling is all well and good, but there's a sweet spot between balling things, surviving, and then dishing it out. Currrently I find that sometimes, just on the point when I'm about to land the whirlwind/earthshaker, I die 1 second short and it all goes to hell.

When balling I rely on my armor and prot spirit and have no defensive skills (pure strength spec). Should I bring some so that I can survive longer? Or have more micro'ed prots on heros such as SoA? I would like something that is not overly cumbersome to use.

I guess as well I should be quick and efficient in balling foes as if I take too long about it, SoA would run out and I will die.

Personally I have never had any problem maintaining adrenaline for SY and Earthshaker. Crude swing with For Great Justice usually charges it instantly for me and after that its just a matter of what works for the situation. If you have aggro control SY is not necessary just concentrate on keeping the baddies on their ass. But if aggro breaks then you still have the opportunity to support the team.

Sadly, there is not much you can do if the rest of your team is running around aggroing like a drunken Irishman at a kegger. At that point all you really can do (if you haven't corner blocked or something like that) is use SY and hope the damage to the team is either reduced until you can kill stuff or maybe they will say "hey that guy only has 80 AL now, let's get him!"

Pre-protting yourself is always a good idea. But the main focus should be killing things as quick as possible. If you are waiting for enemies to ball up nice around you for one massive satisfying bitch slap that is ok to a point. Like you said, you often find yourself dying before you can get off the money shot. Killing huge mobs at a single time is what farmers do, killing mobs before they can hurt your team is what a warrior managing aggro does. The best place to set up those balls is around corners and other environmental features. In open areas, your best bet is to just unleash as much pain as you can while making sure the backline is safely tucked away.

Ryno_Noobslayer · Jan 21, 2011, 01:11 AM // 01:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

You may find the following thread useful, especially the videos.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/p...tml?t=10434178

Also this is an awesome post for showing examples of corner blocking, and using environmental effects. Visual aids are what I always try to find and this helped me tremendously when I first started playing warrior seriously.

iostream · Jan 21, 2011, 01:25 AM // 01:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterB

You may find the following thread useful, especially the videos.

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/p...tml?t=10434178

That thread is made of win. Thanks for posting that!

maxxfury · Jan 21, 2011, 06:48 AM // 06:48

Mobs kite aoe clockwise around you ^... stand at the appropriate wall xD

A simple one, that a lot of ppl miss

(hope to christ i didnt brain fart at 7am....and get the wrong direction :P)

Anime Divine · Jan 21, 2011, 02:17 PM // 14:17

if you got eotn consider bringing drunken master and feel no pain along.
for me there are 3 stages of difficultys in hardmode.

1. easy where you can just run in and kill stuff. flag hero just behind take the initial spike damage release hero and blow up stuff consider going after monk first.

2. medium when there are more groups close to each other. consider making use of corners or drag them a long way back.
what maxfury said is sometimes true but theres not always a good spot on both sides. for me personally it doesnt matter. the technique to block at walls and corners is to stand justa a lil bit off the wall.
going directly after monk is a nono fortunately when monsters are blocked and your heroes keep healing you you will notice the monk will block himself.
and then you can blow them up with eoe

3.hard(core) most difficult settings i faced were always the ones with more than 3 groups or a party of just 4 vs HM monsters.
here is where you absolutely have to tank at any corner or wall.
if you simply cant out damage them consider bringing dolyak signet with you it helps alot. just keep tanking at corners. but first try to lure them from a long way. sometimes you get lucky then only 1 stays behind with no monk to heal. if you kill just one you manage to break a group.

hope this makes sense :P i was a bit bored.

I Hate Chips · Jan 21, 2011, 06:25 PM // 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryno_Noobslayer

Link to Marty's Guide:
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/w...t10326347.html

Read this, usefull thread from an experienced warrior.

LifeInfusion · Jan 21, 2011, 07:29 PM // 19:29

PUG aggro control: "Save Yourselves!". Profit.

Mobs target whoever has lowest armor and health

Run +5 armor mods on your sword/axe, since SY! gives everyone +100 armor you have lowest armor (even though it should be rather high at 145 with "I am unstoppable!", it isn't going to be 160).

Warrior = 116 (sentinel's + shield) + I am unstoppable (+24) + 5 armor weapon = 145

because
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryno_Noobslayer

Sadly, there is not much you can do if the rest of your team is running around aggroing like a drunken Irishman at a kegger. At that point all you really can do (if you haven't corner blocked or something like that) is use SY and hope the damage to the team is either reduced until you can kill stuff or maybe they will say "hey that guy only has 80 AL now, let's get him!"